Keepin' it real fake, part CV: Chinese automakers invade Detroit Auto Show
They're not hybrids or all-electrics, and you likely won't be distracted their overflowing in-car technology, so they're not exactly in our usual scope of coverage, but this new batch of vehicles from a couple of Chinese automakers is certainly right at home in our keepin' it real fake series, which is somehow never starved for material. Among those that did their best to blend in at the Detroit Auto Show is Geely and its Cadillac-esque HIFUN model pictured above, as well as the double-take-inducing ChangFeng Hyundai-lookalike and BYD Auto's Mercedes-influenced F8, both pictured after the break. What's more, unlike the vast majority of KIRFs we see, at least some of these will supposedly be available round these parts in the not so distant future, and at the expected steep discounts over the vehicles their creator's seem to be so fond of as well.
Read - CarDomain, Geely HIFUN
Read - CarDomain, BYD Auto F8
Read - Autoblog, The Return of ChangFeng
[Thanks, Brian]
Read - CarDomain, Geely HIFUN
Read - CarDomain, BYD Auto F8
Read - Autoblog, The Return of ChangFeng
[Thanks, Brian]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
Baba Booey @ Jan 16th 2008 4:36PM
Is that top pic supposed to be a last-gen Accord?
austin @ Jan 16th 2008 4:39PM
try cadilac cts
Lobsang @ Jan 16th 2008 4:48PM
The only originality to it is the 3 fugly big head rest in the back!
and is it suppose to deliver high fun? hifun? lol
aguiluz @ Jan 16th 2008 4:56PM
Would it pass the crash test?
Because it would not be "HIFUN" when you die instantly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F06LjugtIUo
MikeG @ Jan 16th 2008 5:45PM
With a Skoda badge?
Navi Thach @ Jan 17th 2008 12:29AM
Hifun? Sounds like Chow Fun. Dammnit, now I'm hungry.
Dralion76 @ Jan 16th 2008 4:39PM
Ain't that the SKODA emblem?
Jon K @ Jan 16th 2008 4:44PM
i googled the company; it does look skoda-esque! http://www.geely.com/english/index.htm
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 4:39PM
wow, all have four wheels and at least 2 doors. What a ripoff! Those Chinese should be shot.
stickmanfc73_ @ Jan 16th 2008 4:47PM
I don't get it. Are you making fun of people that talk about Apple? Those are all clear ripoffs of vehicles manufactured by other auto companies. I mean that first one bites off the Cadillac CTS hard. You really must not drive around or something.
mik @ Jan 16th 2008 4:48PM
i'm all for "inspiration" but looking at a different manufacturers design and thinking "how can i make that as cheap as possible?" doesnt really qualify for it has 4 wheels and atleast 2 doors. hyundai did it for years but have done a decent job creating their own identity recently.
I think i'll stay away from a car that gives me cancer while driving it..
whuzza @ Jan 16th 2008 5:03PM
Chinese automakers are notorious for making near identical knockoffs. Like this Smart TwoFour and Hummer: http://www.zimbio.com/Chinese+Car+Companies/articles/16/Two+Extremes+Chinese+Knockoffs
Unfortunately, they copy the aesthetics and take out the expensive stuff... like a strong enough body structure.
Brilliance BS6 Crash Test: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F06LjugtIUo
Unlike a fake iPod, you can kill or be killed by one of these contraptions.
Jeff @ Jan 16th 2008 7:34PM
stickmanfc73_:
If you think that looks like a CTS, then you frankly have no taste or design sense. What, they're both somewhat angular? So is a cardboard box, but it doesn't look much like a CTS either.
I just don't see the similarities to any of the cars in question here. It's like looking at a glass of Budweiser and saying it's a copy of Krug Champagne because it's the same color, it's alcoholic and it's got bubbles.
Note that this is not a compliment to the Chinese car makers.
Mal F4cti0n @ Jan 16th 2008 4:46PM
The similarities to the Lexus logo are pretty obvious in the SUV.
The similarities to the mercedes body around the light casing is obvious as well.
Is this legal in the world market to completely copy the body style of another car? I know Hyndai did it with their new elantra when compared to the four-door accord. The only way to tell those two cars apart is when you can see Honda or Hyndai on the back or the different H's on the front.
jake @ Jan 17th 2008 10:23PM
@Donald Melanson too
"The first is the Leopard CS6, the design of which we actually like because it was not only designed by famed Italian firm Pininfarina, but it also bears a slight resemblance to a Hyundai Santa Fe, one of the prettier CUVs on the market."
Link:
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/01/14/detroit-2008-the-return-of-changfeng/
Direct quote from engadget's friends at autoblog commenting on the Changfeng Leopard which this article claims is a fake copy of a Hyundai.
The chinese paid good money to a famed Italian firm for an original design and they obviously still get accused of copying by people in the blogsphere. It's quite reasonable why others in the Chinese car industry will continue copying since they are going to get blamed for copying even if they don't.
Mal F4cti0n @ Jan 18th 2008 9:30AM
I actually commented that the LOGO looked like the trademarked Lexus logo, not that the actual SUV looked like another car.
That's pretty funny. You went out of your way to show that they didn't copy the body style and I never mentioned it on that car.
Do you have anything regarding the Caddy and Mercedes clones? B/c those two car's body styles looked copied (or 'influenced' to the point of copying). Did they hire an Italian design firm to design them a car that looked like another car?
andrew @ Jan 16th 2008 4:47PM
I saw the crash report on these cars... I sucks. By todays standards it would have less than one star and the driver would be injured at almost any speed.
Don't think we'll be seeing these any time soon.
JP23 @ Jan 16th 2008 4:54PM
@Andrew,
How does your sexual preference figure into this? ;)
Jeff @ Jan 16th 2008 8:11PM
I work in China. These cars break down within a year. I know that. Chinese people know that. No one in China with enough moolah will buy these, but some people simply cannot afford a real good ol' Caddy. BTW, "legit" cars cost 2-3 times more than what people in the states are paying.
g512 @ Jan 16th 2008 4:49PM
I don't see how this is "Keeping it real fake" or even a rip off.
Geely is a big car manufacturer in China and their goal has always been to produce cheap cars that a country of a billion+ people can afford. In fact, another recent Engadget article talked about the Tata Nano coming out of India, as the world's cheapest car (at ~$2500).
Its interesting to see these manufactures state-side, it'll be even more interesting to see how they meet all the US safety norms and regulations before they can do any marketing / selling.
-g-
patsy @ Jan 16th 2008 5:04PM
You're kidding, right? Chinese car manufacturers are famous for blatant rip-off designs. Do a quick google for "chinese copycat cars", here's the first hit with some great comparison pictures:
http://gemssty.com/2006/10/29/top-10-copycat-cars
While it's one thing when Lexus copies Mercedes design features (check LS430 vs 90's S class) to create a still luxury car, here you end up with very serious brand devaluation when a piece of shit box on wheels looks almost identical to an expensive car yet offers virtually none of its qualities.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:08PM
Oh, I get it. If you do a crime beautifully and elegantly then it is no more a crime.
r3loaded @ Jan 16th 2008 5:26PM
The difference is that the Indian manufacturers come up with their own designs - Tata even came up with their own manufacturing process for the Nano. Shortly before it went bust, Rover even licensed the Tata Indica design for the City Rover. Soon, all your Jags and Land Rovers will be belong to Tata as well (had to get the Zero Wing thing in, sorry :D ).
On the other hand, many Chinese manufacturers simply prefer to copy the designs that other companies put their hard work into.
g512 @ Jan 16th 2008 5:30PM
Actually no, i'm not kidding. What do you think KIA makes?
If there's a market for cheaper imitation goods, why the heck not make 'em?
In fact, half the electronics/pc market thrives on that very principal - doing/looking the same for less, that is usually 'just enough'.
patsy @ Jan 16th 2008 6:01PM
Except that you're not (usually) dead when your cheap DVD player croaks. They way these Chinese manufacturers save money (other than cheap labor, of course) is through almost complete lack of R&D. This may sound cynical but is exactly the process most of these companies go through when bringing a new product to market: buy and disassemble a rival product down to the minute component level and then duplicate each component as faithfully as possible while using cheaper materials and deleting pieces deemed unnecessary. I read a great article a while back on spiegel.de where the reporters traced a copy of a Bosch drill (I believe) all the way back to the Chinese backyard where it was duplicated and produced and even managed to interview some of the people involved and find out the exact process in the life cycle of this product. The funny thing was that the components were so faithfully copied that they even fit the original product.
The main problem with this approach in cars is that what you see is not always what you get when you copy structural pieces. The shape and folds of a car's chassis, the thickness and weld points of individual areas are very precisely calculated to lead to controlled deformation during an accident. Copying the chassis (even verbatim) without understanding all these factors will lead to a car that may LOOK identical to the naked eye (even in detail), but will behave very differently during a crash. However, judging by the crash pictures of some of the Chinese cars, I'm not sure their manufacturers are familiar with the science of crumple zones at all. They deform so badly as if the engine compartment were simply a four-sided box.
g512 @ Jan 16th 2008 6:12PM
I agree, but thats exactly why we have standards.
In fact, if not for standards and quality control Chinese made toys would still be poisoning kids over here.
Its also true that standards vary across countries. For eg. in India where the TataNano was just launched, there's no airbags included but you don't really need those when you cant move faster than 40km/hr.
What I'm really trying to say here is that like all other foreign products, especially Chinese-made, the auto-industry is also being penetrated and we will eventually get used to that. But it will be a lot sooner than we think, simply because of economics.
Its funny how I still know people here that will not buy a Japanese made car cause they are looking for something "made in the USA".
I personally welcome Chinese autos to the US, and hope that they can meet our safety standards pretty soon.
yelohbird @ Jan 16th 2008 6:42PM
Everyone's missing the point here. These cars were made by Chinese manufacturers to be marketed as affordable vehicles in a fast-industrializing third world nation. They are being displayed at the auto show to bring credibility to their name, i.e. as a publicity stunt. When they go back to China, they say "hey, this car was featured in the Detroit Auto Show". Or if they're even luckier, Car & Driver may pick up a story on these Chinese cars, and they can have bragging rights to being featured in a global car magazine. Nobody said they're gonna be sold in the US. Yet. After all, Hyundai and Kia established their name within their home country first beore penetrating the American market too.
While safety is indeed a concern, (1) 99% of Chinese will never afford a Volvo, and (2) most of these vehicles will be sold in big cities like Beijing where traffic will make sure they can never move more than 30 km/h, and most people don't commute daily on high-speed freeways like in the US. So affordability is step one.
Trent @ Jan 16th 2008 5:07PM
Although the Chinese automakers copy the look they don't copy the safety or the crash worthiness. The first Chinese built car submitted for crash testing in the hopes of importing failed so badly in the 40mph offset crash (killed both occupants) that the car won't be allowed for sale in the US (not unless the seller/importer is willing to foot the liability of killing people). This is on top of the hundreds of additional safety features, and accessories required in the US but not in China. I doubt if you will see a Chinese built car on US roads for at least a decade, and certainly not soon. Massive changes would have to occur first and I sincerely doubt that will happen unless the government of China takes a keen interest in automobile safety.
Wwhat @ Jan 17th 2008 2:05AM
Can't we just decrease the international speedlimit to 30MPH? Problem solved.
PS3guy @ Jan 16th 2008 5:09PM
That car will break down in week just like all of Chinese good.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:13PM
Really? Given that China produces 1/3 of the world shoes(including most of the high-end shoes) I guess you are one of those guys who have to change shoes every other week because they just break down too easily? Oh, yes, many of the components used on US and Japanese cars are also produced in China. Wow, so you are not fraid of being killed by ur car?
bill @ Jan 16th 2008 5:21PM
You mean 95% of the components your computer is using?
Valgas @ Jan 16th 2008 5:15PM
Oh my god. I didn't know they did cars too.
I would purchase an Infirmary Z35 with a solid cast lead engine block.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:16PM
By the way, PS3boy,
PS3 is manufactured by Asustek of Taiwan. X360 is manufactured by Winstron of Taiwan. PSP and Apple iPod are manufactured by Foxconn, subsidiary of Hon-Hai Precision of Taiwan. Many (or almost all Hi-Tech) Taiwanese companies have manufacturing plants in mainland China.
I guess you also have to buy a new PS3 every other week.
makishima @ Jan 16th 2008 5:25PM
Maybe not, but some people need a new 360 each week! Zing!
Note: Before people try to flame me, it was just a joke? I own both and neither one *knock on wood* have broke yet.
makishima @ Jan 16th 2008 5:26PM
Why did I put a ? ? Man its time to go home ...
Ian @ Jan 16th 2008 7:16PM
Yes, but those products are designed and engineered in Japan, the US, Taiwan, etc and manufactured to higher standards. Usually. You sometimes have the substituion of, um, not standard stuff. Like lead and other poisons.
Over the years of watching this I've seen no motivation, effort or drive from the mainland to do anything other than rip off foreigner products and turn a quick profit.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 11:26PM
So how much do you know about products from China? Have you heard about Lenovo? Besides their Thinkpad products which are bought from IBM, they have very good notebooks themselves. Do you know Haier, Chang Hong? They may not be famous here, but they have very solid products, which, by the way, are not cheap rip-offs of foreign products. But to some extent, I agree with you. I hope more and more Chinese manufactures can realise this.
souravgh @ Jan 17th 2008 7:19AM
products like ipods and ps3s are not produced using dirt cheap parts and are most often designed outside china to keep quality high.
western companies award the contract to manufacture their goods to those companies who offer to make them cheap. this inevitevely means chinese. However they do not have the liberty to alter the product's specs.
Products that are designed by chinese manufacturers are very differnt from the psps and ipods. these manufacturers are under no compunction to ensure that their products are asfe or reliable. just because they are made in the same country doesnt mean they are all the same.
llren @ Jan 17th 2008 7:48AM
Well, in every country there are manufacurers who produce good stuff and some others that produce terrible ones. What's the surprise? I was born in China and I have seen both sides. I have good experience with some domestic brands and terrile experience with other domestic brands. There are junks made in other countries as well. I used to own a second hand jeep cheroke and it was a total nightmare.
However, the AVERAGE product quality is positively correlated with the economic development level of a country. There's no doubt about it. I've been saying this from the very beginning. As a developing country, China has a lot to catch up in so many areas. If you dont like Chinese product, fine. Just dont buy them.But try to be reasonable and more tolorant and not to be the rich kid laughing at the poor kid.
kojo87 @ Jan 16th 2008 5:19PM
why any auto would want to look like a Hyundai is beyond me.
drew @ Jan 16th 2008 5:21PM
Dear Chinese Manufacturer,
If you would like to make a product that isn't mocked to kingdom come and reeks of "knock-off" please stop using that nasty variation of Times New Roman all over your vehicle/device and product names like "higoodtimeluckyfunkyfunmonkeycrap" - if all else fails, give it a number with three random letters (no vowels, we don't need another POO910 or CUM89)
If you can't afford market research, get a university intern to help out, their piss cheap!
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:29PM
China has a long way to catch up in so many areas including industrial design, but Rome was not built in one day. Why do you have to be so sarcastic? Chinese cars now are like Japnese cars in the 60s and Korean cars in the 80s. They are not very good in almost every aspect now. But they will become better.
Pavan @ Jan 16th 2008 7:41PM
Don't forget Sony's "TWA/T" pouch...
JBo @ Jan 16th 2008 5:36PM
Wow, they managed to be typically Chinese by stealing other peoples ideas, then still managed to make it fugly.
Jensen @ Jan 17th 2008 12:40PM
Wow, I'd be the first person to say those cars were carbon copies but to be "to be typically Chinese by stealing other peoples ideas" is racism.
DT @ Jan 16th 2008 5:39PM
liren:
The major difference between Chinese cars and any other Chinese-made good is that an automobile is not a piece of technology to trifle with. Minor (and especially major) corner-cutting in the interest of reducing the price as much as possible demolishes a car's safety in an accident. Hyundais of the 80's and Japanese cars of the 60's had to at least meet the current (at the time) safety standards of the US. Chinese made cars now fail so spectacularly that it is unlikely they will get much better in the next decade (as another poster said). The knowledge of safe-car design that other firms have accumulated over years is simply not known in the Chinese car industry, and it will take a new breed of designers and engineers who know and understand car safety features to apply them to the Chinese car industry.
Whereas, if a Chinese-made knock-off DVD player fails, you're simply out $29, not your life.
wslcrew @ Jan 16th 2008 6:15PM
I can't agree more with your comment. It will take Chinese automakers some time before they start realizing the importance of safety in car design.
For now, it seems that the value of life and the issue of safety doesn't concern many Chinese people. Look at lead paints, faulty tyres, fake medicines, poisonous toothpaste, etc. When I went there a couple of years ago, the drivers don't stop for pederistrians crossing the street, and I almost got hit by a car.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:40PM
I am not an auto expert. But if tata nano is truly innovative, I'll give it two thumbs up. Products from India and CHina will be becoming better and better.
llren @ Jan 16th 2008 5:52PM
I am not suggesting that people should buy these Chinese made cars now. As a matter of fact, I will not because I agree with you that it may cost your life. I cannot tell when Chinese cars will meet higher US safety standards. But I can bet it will not take 10 years. Let's wait and see. Time will tell.
Quote from motor trend:
When the Japanese started out, they made some appalling cars, but look at how they've progressed in a few short decades. As for the Koreans - that progression has been far shorter since they produced the horrific Hyundai Pony in 1978. The Chinese have far, far greater resources than the Japanese or the Koreans ever had, all available from the fastest-growing economy on earth. The Chinese have a learning curve faster even than the Koreans. Right now, it's very easy to laugh and joke at the Chinese, but those who make the mistake of doing so (and on these boards, American nationalists who can't see further than the end of their noses are ten-a-penny) will in the coming years soon have the smirks wiped ff ther faces.