Who's suing Apple today? Mirror Worlds takes aim at Time Machine and more
While it's not quite a daily occurrence, it must nearly seem that way for the folks in Apple's legal department, who are now facing yet another lawsuit alleging that the company has infringed on some slightly obscure patents. This latest one comes from Mirror Worlds Technologies, which claims that Apple's Time Machine violates no less than four of its patents that, as AppleInsider reports, describe a "highly visual system that displays a line of documents and other items dating back (or forward) in time along with the option of searching these items to retrieve and edit them." As if that wasn't enough, Mirror Worlds also claims that the iPhone and various iPods also infringe on all but one of the patents, apparently due to the way they sort podcasts and other information. As a result of all of that alleged infringement, Mirror Worlds is seeking the usual injunction against all Apple products in question, and "triple damages," which sure is step above and beyond most of these lawsuits that just seek plain old single damages.
Filed under: Cellphones, Desktops, Laptops, Portable Audio
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
DT @ Mar 18th 2008 8:37PM
I plan to sue Apple for infinity+1 damages because I used to hum music WAY before iTunes did.
3r1c8y @ Mar 19th 2008 11:36AM
why does everyone sue Apple? they're just hating cause they're jealous
David Clark @ Mar 18th 2008 9:46PM
*plugs ears and closes eyes* Apple is wonderful, Apple is wonderful.. la la la.. I can't hear you, patent holders.
I'm shocked that anyone would accuse Apple of stealing ANYTHING! They've never done it before.. *cough*
webon @ Mar 18th 2008 10:11PM
@david: Gesundheit
Michael LaFramboise @ Mar 19th 2008 3:03AM
That won't work DT because Google owns the patent on Infinity+1 in reference to Gmail
r3loaded @ Mar 19th 2008 4:41AM
I have a patent on data, so I'm suing every technology company, Engadget for their numerous articles, and everyone who's posted a comment on this page.
From article: "Submitted late last week to a Tyler Division court in the southern US state" - why am I not surprised??
ryan @ Mar 18th 2008 8:38PM
too bad this patent looks nothing like time machine and somehow this file the person is backing up changes everyday(and file type)
Glen @ Mar 18th 2008 10:11PM
It doesn't matter if it doesn't LOOK like TimeMachine because its a patent on the "concept" of moving backwards and forwards within a list of backups... hence TimeMachine does infringe on their patent.
Glen @ Mar 18th 2008 9:40PM
Ryan... it doesn't matter if the software product looks like something or not, its the "concept/idea" behind it that the patent was granted for. Quite clearly, Apple's TimeMachine does breach the patent that "Mirror Worlds" holds.
Mind you, I agree with someone else here and I also ask "who the hell allows these vague patents through"?!?!?
Nick @ Mar 18th 2008 11:31PM
@ Glen
I thought you cant patent "ideas/concepts" just technology and executions. If Time Machine operates in a different manner than this companies product then Apple didn't infringe.
Glen @ Mar 19th 2008 12:12AM
@Nick - although I agree about airy-fairy patents about just ideas or concepts, it appears 99% of American patents ARE allowed for stuff like this :(
BTW if you read Mirrow Worlds patent (and Engadgets comments) their patent is for a "highly visual system that displays a line of documents and other items dating back (or forward) in time along with the option of searching these items to retrieve and edit them." - is this exactly HOW TimeMachine displays its data, thus Apple have breached the patent.
You need to forget about WHAT actual data the program is dealing with (whether it be system backups, file listings, music listings (in the case of CoverFlo) etc... its just *the process itself* for accessing that data that Mirrow Worlds have a patent.
Rob K @ Mar 19th 2008 8:30AM
@ Glen
By posting the same idea twice, I think your post at 10:11pm might legally infringe on the idea/concept of your post made at 9:40pm.
Nick @ Mar 19th 2008 12:48PM
I dont care about that the type of data that is being restored, I care about how apples system goes about retrieving and logging the information. If it is not the same way of doing it as this Mirror company, then Apple isn't infringing. If it goes to court, a smart judge will ask if Apples code infringes on Mirror's code. If it doesn't then there isn't infringement. You cannot patent ideas.
When patents on ideas are rewarded they often times are voided by the court. As has happened recently due to the flood of patents applications that came in in the early-mid 90's that were approved by non-tech people. Non tech people in the patent office having to approve patent submissions for technology that they know nothing about causes "ideas" and "common knowledge" to get patents that are often times overturned and revoked in time.
I'm not saying Apple is innocent, but lets get off what it looks like and look at how it works. How they index the backups and how they retrieve the backups and how they restore the backups.
JAmerican @ Mar 18th 2008 8:40PM
So I guess this is the new series. I guess "Who's suing Microsoft Today?" would clutter and cause all the Apple fans to go away.
BTW I own a PowerBook so there.
Jm @ Mar 18th 2008 8:42PM
this deserves more lines that win vista sp1?
Lein @ Mar 18th 2008 9:12PM
Well, keep in mind who they've got paying the bills...
James Ollier @ Mar 18th 2008 9:12PM
Vista SP1 actually slows down your computer.
At least 2008 is the year that you don't have to pay $500 to downgrade your PC..
Neebs @ Mar 18th 2008 9:17PM
What $500? The too much you paid for a MacBook to run Windows on it?
Sorry guys, I had to go there.
Tiptup300 @ Mar 18th 2008 10:02PM
Ok, last stray, I'm done reading engadget. Now I got a new column for my rss reader!
Charlie @ Mar 18th 2008 8:53PM
But, but... Mirror World Technologies doesn't even EXIST any more!
http://web.archive.org/web/20040525201018/http://scopeware.com/
derX @ Mar 18th 2008 8:54PM
What the hell, I'm going to sue Apple, too.
I, err, contrived a special way to, err...dammit, I give up.
I couldn't think of a way to work "patent" and "Apple" together...I'm sure there was a simple joke there.
I ph33l.
PainlessProd @ Mar 18th 2008 8:54PM
i think everyone is getting tired of how much apple is on your site, please stop
Bite my @ Mar 18th 2008 9:04PM
I think it's just fine that Apple is on this site more and more.
Their computer system are growing in popularity and uniqueness.
It's a breath of fresh air compared to all this PC news and they have the right to have their news published on this site.
My 2¢
Seth @ Mar 18th 2008 10:02PM
Umm, what PC news? Oh yeah, Service Pack 1...that got buried in other news and was shrugged over by iPhone 2.0 (or 1.2) software. Yeah, I like your humor.
N30 G30 @ Mar 18th 2008 9:13PM
I'm more sick of small desperate companies suing huge innovative companies for using the color blue.
Apple created back up hardware and software. There should be nothing wrong with that.
James Ollier @ Mar 18th 2008 9:14PM
Don't like it?
Don't click it,
Don't read it,
Don't comment it
painlessprod @ Mar 19th 2008 1:36PM
I love this site, i just cant stand that every other post is about apple, who cares
annoy @ Mar 18th 2008 8:57PM
Looks more like that patent shown is like vista Flip 3D then Time Machine. But thats just me.
hackman @ Mar 18th 2008 9:02PM
Who sued Apple yesterday?
John Aubrey @ Mar 18th 2008 9:19PM
I"m not sure what that picture is of. I see a search box, well if they lose they can always go after apple's spotlight, and while your at it, I think Google and Microsoft both have search engines on their pages as well!
If the company doesn't exist anymore, how are they seeking damages, Apple hasn't damaged a company that doesn't exist anymore.
The Progn0sticator @ Mar 18th 2008 9:27PM
It amazes me how vague some of these patents can be, who the hell lets them get through?!
derX @ Mar 18th 2008 9:35PM
Bite my , if one is in, say, UK or EU, you're two cents are worthless.
Who knew the exchange rates would make our opinions worth less?
YoMomma @ Mar 18th 2008 9:44PM
today we got like 4 Apple related posts and the relase of MS Windows Vista SP1. Just one post.
Remember when the Iphone SDK came out, they wrote thousands of posts. and Windows Vista SPI being more importan than a SDK, the sdk gets more articles.
This blog should be called Unofficial Apple Blog and other stuff that doesn't matter to us.
Reid @ Mar 18th 2008 11:44PM
The difference is, despite Apple's much smaller market share in computers, more consumers care about OS X than care about Vista. Seriously. I know Windows admins and have many Windows-using friends. They care more about OS X than Vista.
I'm not sure if that means every little patent lawsuit deserves coverage, but don't pretend like anyone cares about Vista SP1.
About the only people excited about Vista are businesses, and they have their own magazines and such aimed at taking advantage of the new features in Windows OSes that will affect what they can do in the enterprise.
Richy @ Mar 19th 2008 10:24AM
Agreed. I downloaded the latest update to Safari before I bothered getting Vista SP1 for the missus' Vaio. Still don't think SP1 will help the fact that the Vaio has slowly ground to a halt since buying it. She's getting a MacBook next, whether she likes it or not!
Astro @ Mar 18th 2008 9:44PM
Great to see the fanboys rushing to do-no-wrong Apple's defense without having a clue as to the legitimacy of the lawsuit.
Oh, "triple damages" are treble damages, which you're awarded if another entity is found to have willfully infringed your patent (i.e. the infringer knew of the existence of the patent it infringed before it did so).
I love Engadget's legal wherewithal. "Hurr, triple damages, as though normal damages aren't good enough!" Wow, you made a funny!
Otherwise, I love Engadget's coverage. I don't know how I'd live without a post every time Steve Jobs so much as farts.
The Dude @ Mar 18th 2008 10:29PM
Perhaps Engadget should let Nilay handle the news with Legalese.
Jason @ Mar 18th 2008 9:46PM
Yeah, really. How can you 'patent' half this stuff? Most of it is painfully obvious, anymore, like trying to patent how to create a 'text editor'. Ooo.
Someone patented the idea of opening up multiple windows with your various file versions? Give me a break. I'd implement it that way just because it seems like a really logical way to do it.
For code, do they have to prove that Apple had any idea who these people were?
This sort of thing makes me frightened to even consider doing business in this country, when I could come up with anything on my own and some joker with a company I never heard of could toss a 'patent' in my face because they thought of something like 'backup with multiple windows' first. This patent looks like it's for some software made back in the early Mac days. How old is this junk they're dredging up? And who is Mirror Worlds, anyway? I can't find anything about them.
Jimmy Jones @ Mar 18th 2008 9:46PM
it's high time Mr. El-Jobso & Co cough-up some benjamins.... it's been M$FT l8ly...I guess it's Sub for Apple. Go ahead fight it like the original idea is yours from scratch...
Daniel @ Mar 18th 2008 10:01PM
some should sue apple for infrign on aplles and making people think that an aplle is computer and not a fruit.
Zorque @ Mar 18th 2008 10:03PM
Sorting stuff in chronological order? Why didn't I think of that?!
The Dude @ Mar 18th 2008 10:22PM
There needs to be some sort of patent reform where if you have no intent to develop/implement or at least license, then you're S.O.L. when someone actually does. It's like those goddamn domain name squatters that try to bleed you for money for them to sign it over. Douche bags!
Motoken @ Mar 18th 2008 10:36PM
i'm sueing everyone because they used my organization scheme! thats not a patent on anything! thats like patenting FPS games or RTS games, or putting you school papers in chronological order.
Jung Kim @ Mar 18th 2008 11:05PM
it's about time to re-do our justice system.
Daniel @ Mar 18th 2008 11:39PM
if we redo or justice system how are all the lawyers going to make and money in this country.
Reid @ Mar 18th 2008 11:32PM
At least this patent looks non-obvious.
Whether that is a justification for this specific patent, or patents in general, or the lawsuits, or whatever, I will leave up to those who care...
uclatommy @ Mar 18th 2008 11:59PM
This looks like an email search except that instead of presenting the messages in rows in a table ordered by date, it is presented in a cascade of windows. Pretty dumb idea if you ask me.
Decoy @ Mar 19th 2008 1:00AM
This looks NOTHING like time machine. Can't be a copy. Apple doesn't copy.
However, if Microsoft came out with software that looked like this it would mean they are copying Apple.
CAP'N @ Mar 19th 2008 1:00AM
Where there's a Mirror World, there's a Mr.Susan.
Gab SEO ROI Goldenberg @ Mar 19th 2008 1:32AM
I've never heard of "triple damages," and I'm finishing up my second year of law school (admittedly here in Canada). Odd... Perhaps they meant damages, plus punitive and exemplary damages? Or perhaps 3x the value of their loss?